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Marcel Offermans Rejoin Plugin

S

Sebastian Roehn

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Hi guys,

those who have participated at races on www.sim-racing.org in the last years already know this tool. Or maybe you have heard of it anywhere else.

For rF1 brought this plugin endurance races surely to new a level. It makes rejoining possible, races can be restarted after an issue easily and also the aspect of team work comes more to the fore. The first version we used around 2 years ago had surely some bugs, only simple scoring pages and simple functionality of the penalties. But with the time Marcel did a very great job and the actual version is imho pretty awesome.

Although rFactor2 has now its own rejoin to race feature...with the help of Marcel Offermans ;) ...there are still some advantages of his plugin to use it for endurance races.

Pro's
  • The length of the rejoin penalties can be adjusted independently
  • time from the disconnect until the rejoin will be substracted off the rejoin penalty
  • if the race needs to be stopped no matter why, it can be restarted very easily for the drivers and server admins
  • teams have additional information and can spotter their driver (I know there are other tools like f.e. Stefan Mizzi's rF2 live timing which can offer nearly the same informations)
Con's
  • you get some additional load on the server for the usage of the tool. But if you are using some other plugins to share additional data for the teams, they do that too
  • blue flags are only visible at the scoring/team pages from the plugin and not in rF itself...so a spotter is definitely mandatory. Imho I like that because team work is more important and can make a difference.
  • in rF2 is it possibe to select whether a team rejoins with the damage before they had left the server or no damage. But that counts only for race session if I informed correctly. Because races with the rejoin plugin are held in a practice session, damages cannot be saved
Maybe there are more points for each category and of course this is also my personal opinion and experience with probably over 20 races with this plugin in the last 2 years.

So I think it is worth to think about it. I also don't know if the actual rejoin to race feature in rF2 is working correctly. There were from time to time reports of bugs with this feature in different builds.

@Jimmi: I have a good rapport to Marcel, know the actual version and can help you with installing the plugin and explain who to use it. Or of course first can maybe answer upcoming questions. But I don't know much technical details. I helped Marcel with bug tracing and I developed a tool called raceXMLcreator who generates a race session xml file out of the logfiles from the rejoin plugin (can than be used for league system or rFactor report) or optionally creates a own html race report.
 
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this plugin was nice, but brought confusions imo, as we got the rejoin feature we dont need this anymore. sure i appreciate the fact u mention teamwork (with spotting) as i think thats the coolest thing about this feature, i still think this system is a bit complex.
 
Currently we´re running a few plugins and have been testing things for a new season, im sorry to be turning down ideas. But theres a time for change and thats not now tbh. We want the things to run smoothly without too much hasle and new things for teams to learn.
 
I would be nice if you can be more specific about what means "a few plugins". For what?

And to call the rejoin plugin for a driver as complex...mmh. The old version ok, but not the actual. This is something which you can learn in only one test session. Who don't understand it in such a short time will be definitely also have issues to understand and follow the rules here ;)
 
Sebastian Roehn said:
I would be nice if you can be more specific about what means "a few plugins". For what?

And to call the rejoin plugin for a driver as complex...mmh. The old version ok, but not the actual. This is something which you can learn in only one test session. Who don't understand it in such a short time will be definitely also have issues to understand and follow the rules here ;)
Click to expand...
the rules are already made i am afraid, so i think this is a No-Go.
 
I haven't asked you mate ;)

Just read the rules about race restarts. That makes clear if that happens there will be good chance that the race is simply over or that it needs much time to restore the standing and restart the race. With the rejoin plugin is that normally made in 10-15min.

And the larger the grid, the larger the chance the dedicated server to fail. I don't believe statements like "rF2 can run with 100 vehicle" especially for endurance races. Maybe this is working for a 30min race...but 12h. I really have my doubts.
 
First off, plans have been made for Season 7, we use ISI´s race rejoin, perhaps theres a plugins which does the same... i dont know and honestly havent researched it. We are giving feedback to ISI as we go.
I planned a season and you just joined, please have a little respect of what we´ve worked for here instead of thinking that your idea is the best in the world and we will have to use it. As posted elsewhere, ideas are good - but now is NOT the time. Im still really busy doing other stuff, so i would simply not have the time nor interest (to be totally honest) of using time on setting up another plugin.

We run 3 plugins, which i will not list here right now.
 
Sebastian Roehn said:
And the larger the grid, the larger the chance the dedicated server to fail. I don't believe statements like "rF2 can run with 100 vehicle" especially for endurance races. Maybe this is working for a 30min race...but 12h. I really have my doubts.
Click to expand...
30 minutes or 12 hours doesent really matter. However thanks but no thanks.
 
@Jimmi: I never have written here that my ideas are the best and it is mantadory to use this tool! I started a discussion about it...nothing more.
But you stopped it shortly by pointing to nothing specific. Sorry that I'm interested in some details. I also know what it means to plan a series...I have done this more than once. But now I'm being honest and please don't take this comment in a wrong way...you don't know this plugin and reject like a bit in good old german saw "Some peaple won't eat anything they've never seen before".

There is not ONLY one way to organize good endurance series and I would never presume that I know them all ;). So don't be angry about my posts. It should not mean that I won't give your concept a try. I just interested in some details...

And if we are not discuss about the usage of this plugin, but there are also no specifications (at least I haven't found them so far) what's about rejoin penalties, damage setting for rejoining etc?
 
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Honestly, i have plenty to do beside discussing ideas from people, trust me inbox is filled every single morning + all the things people dont see here. I dont change things in the middle of the season for no apparent reason, the rejoin works like a charm. We cant post everything here, did you read about it on ISI´s forum?
We´ve set it at rejoin possible but you get the exact same damage as when you left. There are NO penalties for rejoining, but you will have to use the time to rejoin, so thats a penalty by itself.

Yes i reject it, its not the first nor the last time i will do that. :) We have a working rejoin from ISI whom we work together with, so im not gonna change - at least not for this season.
 
Jimmi Allison said:
I dont change things in the middle of the season for no apparent reason, the rejoin works like a charm. We cant post everything here, did you read about it on ISI´s forum?
Click to expand...

Yes, I visit and read often in that forum and there were definitely from time to time complains about the rejoin function, because the laps were not restored correctly. But never mind...I will not ask or write about it again. I really understand that you are busy but is a forum not also a place where you can discuss some things? Again...my intention was not to coerce to use this plugin. I also don't get anything from Marcel if you use it ;)

But maybe if you have eventually some time and you are interested in some infos, just ask.
 
I know it is not an option for this season, but just for those who want to take a further look at this Rejoin Plugin.

Racedepartment is also using it and the scoring pages can been seen for their todays testrace:

Scoring: http://85.214.116.246:8080/track/scoring.html (click on the driver or team name shows a new data window specific for the selected vehicle)

Track map: http://85.214.116.246:8080/track/track.html

There is also live ticker available. The Rejoin Plugin will be also used on the 24h Spa Race on www.gtr24h.org event. A really great LAN event at Denmark/Kolding, where they used this year for the first time rF2 and the rejoin plugin. Also the eveloper of the plugin Marcel Offermans will join this event.

I know rF2 has it's own rejoin possibility but there is one important thing missing for endurance racing. It has no backup file in case the race needs to be stopped and restarted. To restore the scoring is than expensive. The Rejoin plugin saves every lap when the leader crosses the line a backup file. Those can be loaded and the race can be restarted in only a few minutes. For the race start or restart has every car a starting position on track and the scoring shows a distance in meter for each team from the pits to their starting position. The procedure is normally not really hard to understand.
 
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Again, I see how this would be ok in rf1. But with rf2 I really don't see the need, if there was thrown a red flag there are pretty good rules here. But I'm still not calling you names.
Gtr24h, I would use all the tools I could if I were them - as far as I've seen nothing works server wise ;)
However no matter how many leagues are using it - we are nothing like them, and don't really want to be like everyone else.
It might be good for them, i don't know. But I've said it in rf1 and I will say it again - I will not now not ever run any events in practice mode.
Also advertise for this plugin on Isis forum instead of here. Sorry I'm not thrilled by this plugin, but that dosent mean im calling you names... Just FYI.
 
Jimmi Allison said:
...if there was thrown a red flag there are pretty good rules here
Click to expand...

These ones?

6.8. Red flag - server crash - If the race is restarted
6.8.1 The server log, replay, or other sources will be used to determine the positions on the end of the last completed lap, cars will line up for the restart based on this order.
Click to expand...

What server log? Some live timing logs? Real rF2 log files are not available because they will be written only after a session change. If the server had crashed, they are lost. I know this already from the admin and driver side. Using some external table scoring to restore the session is annoying and takes many time. But I'm exciting how you and your team will handle it.

Jimmi Allison said:
But I've said it in rf1 and I will say it again - I will not now not ever run any events in practice mode.
Click to expand...

There we come to the bottom of it. Your league, your choice and my thoughts about this opinion. I did wrote this last post not especially for you and sorry that I allowed me to post something about it or to link to other sites. I though a forum is therefor available.
 
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